I get what you’re saying, but I’m not sure you realize just how much that would hurt people. Europe is much more densely concentrated and has far better public transit options. Many parts of the US are extremely rural. My nearest grocery store is a 30 minute drive away. There are no stores in walking distance at all. There are no sidewalks. There are no busses, trains, or cabs in my area, and that is not wildly uncommon.
If costs of gas doubled, at least without viable alternatives, it would absolutely bankrupt people. And it would disproportionately impact poor people in rural areas where it’s very common to commute to work 30-60 minutes of driving is a common commute. While it varies by state, US federal minimum wage in the US is $7.25/hour. Many people commute for work, and an hour drive one way is also not uncommon.
Let’s take 7.25 an hour x 40 hours = $290 before taxes.
We’ll keep it simple and say a person uses only 1 gallon of gas per day to get to and from work which, at $8 a gallon x 5 days a week = $40. Just that travel to and from work and no other travel at all (or maintenance on the vehicle) would be 14% of pre-tax income.
I agree but will counter, maybe people should be prioritizing buying motorcycles and heated jackets over trucks and suvs that make up 80% of new sales. I think gas price should be based off mpg MORE than now. If you get 15 mpg than you pay 15 per gallon. Get 30mpg you pay 7 per gallon. Only exceptions are for vehicles used for operational work, not commuting.
That’s a fair counter, and I definitely agree there are many things that could be changed to improve the situation.I also think the US needs to move away from large vehicles, and it’s a huge problem that so many people are purchasing vehicles that get poor mileage and are ultimately bad for the environment.
I would argue though that there are some issues with the motorcycle suggestion. First, in many areas of the country it’s only feasible to ride a motorcycle about half the year due to weather. In the New England area, it’s only feasible in the summer. Otherwise, the snow and ice make it far too dangerous. Plus, if you have a family/children, then you also need some kind of car, so now you have to buy, register, inspect, and maintain two vehicles. There are also costs for getting a motorcycle endorsement on your license and an additional fee each time you renew your license to maintain that motorcycle endorsement on your license.
The problem with the “pay per mpg” would be older cars. I used to drive a very old car with very bad gas mileage. I also lived in that car. There’s risk of disproportionately impacting people with low income. Of course, that could be countered based off the the year of the car, or income, or some other thing – but I’m sure there would be loopholes and other issues there.
Anyways, really interesting topic to consider. Thanks for the respectful discourse!
Good reply, id fully support the exception for those living in vehicles and having the cost decay over time like registration does.
As for the cold, thats only a part of the country for a part of the year. I can buy 2 reliable cars and a motorcycle for the cost of 1 new luxury truck. People want new big and flashy to feel self important, ita sad. But I guess that acceptance of debt is what keeps America going now idk.
maybe people should be prioritizing buying motorcycles and heated jackets
Tell me you’ve never been to the US without telling me.
I’m an avid motorcycle rider. I’ve been riding for over 20 years. I’ve ridden in all sorts of weather. I once had to lie in a muddy ditch next to my harley while the tornado went by. More than once I’ve ridden 30 miles (48.6 kilometers for those who can’t multiply by 1.62) in the snow.
The issue is, snow, ice, and tornadoes aren’t good for most people on a motorcycle. I’m one of the few completely crazy people who does ride in all weather. But the US is a place with some pretty crazy weather, and many parts of the country str too cold or too icy to ride in for half the year. So even if we collectively bought a Grom and a nice riding suit with a heated vest, most people couldn’t ride it for a big chunk of the year.
A much better suggestion, until we can get some sort of public transport, is small cars, but every time someone makes a small economy car in the US, most people act like it’s an affront to their very testicles and they spend a weirdly large chunk of their time complaining about said cars, even if they dont own one. For examples, see opinions on: Toyota Prius, Chevy Spark, Mitsubishi Mirage.
I mean that was exactly my point. I lived in denver and ny and I dont ride under 35 degrees F unless its only 5 min. Going careless wasnt my real reccomendation, but its a huge answer for a huge swath of population. I live in socal now and its trucks and suvs as far as the eye can see. And If even this crowd is going to downvote me, then its even more dire than I realized. People are crazy car centric, and its irresponsible way to live
I get what you’re saying, but I’m not sure you realize just how much that would hurt people. Europe is much more densely concentrated and has far better public transit options. Many parts of the US are extremely rural. My nearest grocery store is a 30 minute drive away. There are no stores in walking distance at all. There are no sidewalks. There are no busses, trains, or cabs in my area, and that is not wildly uncommon.
If costs of gas doubled, at least without viable alternatives, it would absolutely bankrupt people. And it would disproportionately impact poor people in rural areas where it’s very common to commute to work 30-60 minutes of driving is a common commute. While it varies by state, US federal minimum wage in the US is $7.25/hour. Many people commute for work, and an hour drive one way is also not uncommon.
Let’s take 7.25 an hour x 40 hours = $290 before taxes.
We’ll keep it simple and say a person uses only 1 gallon of gas per day to get to and from work which, at $8 a gallon x 5 days a week = $40. Just that travel to and from work and no other travel at all (or maintenance on the vehicle) would be 14% of pre-tax income.
petrol is about 1.5x the price in Australia compared to America with similar geographies to deal with
Geography maybe, but the population distribution is still quite different.
yeah, if anything we are more spread out in australia
I agree but will counter, maybe people should be prioritizing buying motorcycles and heated jackets over trucks and suvs that make up 80% of new sales. I think gas price should be based off mpg MORE than now. If you get 15 mpg than you pay 15 per gallon. Get 30mpg you pay 7 per gallon. Only exceptions are for vehicles used for operational work, not commuting.
That’s a fair counter, and I definitely agree there are many things that could be changed to improve the situation.I also think the US needs to move away from large vehicles, and it’s a huge problem that so many people are purchasing vehicles that get poor mileage and are ultimately bad for the environment.
I would argue though that there are some issues with the motorcycle suggestion. First, in many areas of the country it’s only feasible to ride a motorcycle about half the year due to weather. In the New England area, it’s only feasible in the summer. Otherwise, the snow and ice make it far too dangerous. Plus, if you have a family/children, then you also need some kind of car, so now you have to buy, register, inspect, and maintain two vehicles. There are also costs for getting a motorcycle endorsement on your license and an additional fee each time you renew your license to maintain that motorcycle endorsement on your license.
The problem with the “pay per mpg” would be older cars. I used to drive a very old car with very bad gas mileage. I also lived in that car. There’s risk of disproportionately impacting people with low income. Of course, that could be countered based off the the year of the car, or income, or some other thing – but I’m sure there would be loopholes and other issues there.
Anyways, really interesting topic to consider. Thanks for the respectful discourse!
Good reply, id fully support the exception for those living in vehicles and having the cost decay over time like registration does.
As for the cold, thats only a part of the country for a part of the year. I can buy 2 reliable cars and a motorcycle for the cost of 1 new luxury truck. People want new big and flashy to feel self important, ita sad. But I guess that acceptance of debt is what keeps America going now idk.
Tell me you’ve never been to the US without telling me.
I’m an avid motorcycle rider. I’ve been riding for over 20 years. I’ve ridden in all sorts of weather. I once had to lie in a muddy ditch next to my harley while the tornado went by. More than once I’ve ridden 30 miles (48.6 kilometers for those who can’t multiply by 1.62) in the snow.
The issue is, snow, ice, and tornadoes aren’t good for most people on a motorcycle. I’m one of the few completely crazy people who does ride in all weather. But the US is a place with some pretty crazy weather, and many parts of the country str too cold or too icy to ride in for half the year. So even if we collectively bought a Grom and a nice riding suit with a heated vest, most people couldn’t ride it for a big chunk of the year.
A much better suggestion, until we can get some sort of public transport, is small cars, but every time someone makes a small economy car in the US, most people act like it’s an affront to their very testicles and they spend a weirdly large chunk of their time complaining about said cars, even if they dont own one. For examples, see opinions on: Toyota Prius, Chevy Spark, Mitsubishi Mirage.
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I mean that was exactly my point. I lived in denver and ny and I dont ride under 35 degrees F unless its only 5 min. Going careless wasnt my real reccomendation, but its a huge answer for a huge swath of population. I live in socal now and its trucks and suvs as far as the eye can see. And If even this crowd is going to downvote me, then its even more dire than I realized. People are crazy car centric, and its irresponsible way to live