Yeah, but the Apollo dev didn’t have the huge server costs that Reddit has. I’m not defending Reddit at all, but this is just comparing apples to oranges.
Im a way, yeah. They clearly they made a shitty app to extract as much value from their users as possible. But my point was that Reddit has significantly higher costs than third party app developers (because they host the content), so the business model that works for third party app developers doesn’t work for them.
Looking at a third party app - made by someone who doesn’t have to bear the costs of running the site and can therefore make decent money on an ad-free experience - and a first party one which does have to recoup those expenses doesn’t really work. The financial models are just fundamentally different.
I don’t say that to defend Reddit. They’re clearly a shitty company headed by shitty people, and I’m sure they could’ve found different ways to make money. But yeah, their financial incentives for making an app are fundamentally different than those of other devs.
No one was saying reddit couldn’t implement API costs. In fact, every major 3rd party app developer, including Apollo, supported Reddit charging for API access and made suggestions on how such an arrangement could be made that was fair and reasonable to all parties. Reddit even invited these developers to discussions on the topic. However, Reddit’s CEO said fuck that and wanted to charge an insane amount of money for API usage that no 3rd party developers would be able to reasonably afford without asking for an exorbitant amount of money from their users.
This link is really the one that discussed how willing 3rd party devs were to pay for API access if it was a fair cost. Reddit wasn’t interested in being fair.
Server costs don’t force you to make a bloated and shitty app experience. You might have an argument that 3rd party apps put strain on the servers, but that’s just reddits fault for making an awful and borderline unusable UX.
I think he’s arguing that the organization, being several hundred times bigger, makes it a lot harder to focus on one thing, like making the app awesome.
As an example, in an hour long meeting you’d spend x% of the time on server costs, another y% on, i dunno, legal, another % on how to enshittify, and finally 5 minutes on the app.
Yeah, but the Apollo dev didn’t have the huge server costs that Reddit has. I’m not defending Reddit at all, but this is just comparing apples to oranges.
So the reason reddit struggled to develop a decent app is… because of server costs?
Seriously. They still don’t have a way to increase the font size on the default app last I checked. How is such a basic feature STILL lacking?
Im a way, yeah. They clearly they made a shitty app to extract as much value from their users as possible. But my point was that Reddit has significantly higher costs than third party app developers (because they host the content), so the business model that works for third party app developers doesn’t work for them.
Looking at a third party app - made by someone who doesn’t have to bear the costs of running the site and can therefore make decent money on an ad-free experience - and a first party one which does have to recoup those expenses doesn’t really work. The financial models are just fundamentally different.
I don’t say that to defend Reddit. They’re clearly a shitty company headed by shitty people, and I’m sure they could’ve found different ways to make money. But yeah, their financial incentives for making an app are fundamentally different than those of other devs.
No one was saying reddit couldn’t implement API costs. In fact, every major 3rd party app developer, including Apollo, supported Reddit charging for API access and made suggestions on how such an arrangement could be made that was fair and reasonable to all parties. Reddit even invited these developers to discussions on the topic. However, Reddit’s CEO said fuck that and wanted to charge an insane amount of money for API usage that no 3rd party developers would be able to reasonably afford without asking for an exorbitant amount of money from their users.
Here: https://www.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/13ws4w3/had_a_call_with_reddit_to_discuss_pricing_bad/
That was post made by the Apollo dev after their meeting with the Reddit team. With more info here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/14dkqrw/i_want_to_debunk_reddits_claims_and_talk_about/
This link is really the one that discussed how willing 3rd party devs were to pay for API access if it was a fair cost. Reddit wasn’t interested in being fair.
Server costs don’t force you to make a bloated and shitty app experience. You might have an argument that 3rd party apps put strain on the servers, but that’s just reddits fault for making an awful and borderline unusable UX.
I think he’s arguing that the organization, being several hundred times bigger, makes it a lot harder to focus on one thing, like making the app awesome.
As an example, in an hour long meeting you’d spend x% of the time on server costs, another y% on, i dunno, legal, another % on how to enshittify, and finally 5 minutes on the app.