I’d imagine they’re mostly physically disabled people trying to get control of their limbs or access to the freedom this type of tech is promising. As abhorrent as all of the testing behind this tech is, if I were a quadrapalegic or something similar, I would volunteer because wtf else have I got going for me?
That is very true. It doesn’t mean it is ethical. It is quite common for people who are disabled, have a disease, or what not to be overly optimistic about success. Which caused them to be more willing to make poorly informed decisions.
Experiments like these are not inherently bad, but it is very easy to receive informed consent from the participant when they are not fully informed. That is why studies like this in academia require an ethics panel to review them.
To give an Elon musk’s track record with his various companies. I think it is completely reasonable to question the ethics of this study.
It’s not the tech itself that worries me. It’s who in this case is supplying it along with the fact the previous patient had 85% of the functionality just stop and they haven’t done a damn thing to address that before they want to try it on another patient.
There are other companies working on the same or similar tech that are far less fucked up.
Arbaugh says that updates to the chip’s software have allowed him to regain many of the abilities that he previously had and that he is still very supportive of Neuralink and what it’s done for him.
They did try to fix the problem the best they could. Its also a very intense procedure so I doubt it’s smart to go back after so little time. It’s probably better to wait until they fix all the kinks anyways. The man did enough, he doesn’t need to be a debug guinea pig with his head open every month imo.
I’d actually be mad if they used the same guy tbh.
I also think it’s important to seperate the tech from the persona. There’s a lot of smart people behind this and I think it’s sci-fi as fuck.
Look we all hate Elon and how neuralink is developing their tech that’s not in question here.
People are taking issue with your referring to desperate people with very very poor quality of life due to injuries or medical conditions as “brain dead”
They aren’t “brain dead”, dumb or stupid, they are reaching for what looks like the only potential light in their life. A life that is probably impossibly difficult for any of us typically healthy people to imagine.
Is that exclusive para/quadriplegics in your mind? Only that you are countering a statement that essentially says that losing one or more limbs doesnt make people stop loving you, by saying not everyone has people that love them. Which would be a good point if people not loving you was exclusive to people who have lost a limb or limbs…
Did you just try to angle my comment to be about people with disabilities being less capable and/or of less value?
What I countered was a claim where the first part stated that everyone has a life, which is just not true.
For the second part of the claim to have any value in the sentence, the first part has to be true. Which it wasn’t.
Whether I read it wrong or not doesn’t change the fact that I never limited my statement to be about people with disabilities or disabilities automatically taking the life away from people.
So I stand by my claim, that not everyone of the 8 billion living in this planet has a life and people that care about them.
You were responding to a comment about quadriplegics which painted context to your response. If that’s not what you meant, then gine. Im sorry i misunderstood your response. You could have been more clear that you were generalising and not directly responding to the claim being made.
To your point. No not everyone has a life and people that love them but i would argue that a blanket statement that started this thread, that if you were a quadriplegic then you would volunteer to have experimental surgery with unknown side effects and effectiveness because you have nothing else going for you is not inherently true.
You dont need to be quadriplegic to want to volunteer. You dont have to not have anything else going for you, and you dont need to have a life or people that love you.
If all you are saying is not everyone has a life or people that live them, then i fail to see how its relevant to the point made in this thread.
I’d imagine they’re mostly physically disabled people trying to get control of their limbs or access to the freedom this type of tech is promising. As abhorrent as all of the testing behind this tech is, if I were a quadrapalegic or something similar, I would volunteer because wtf else have I got going for me?
That is very true. It doesn’t mean it is ethical. It is quite common for people who are disabled, have a disease, or what not to be overly optimistic about success. Which caused them to be more willing to make poorly informed decisions.
Experiments like these are not inherently bad, but it is very easy to receive informed consent from the participant when they are not fully informed. That is why studies like this in academia require an ethics panel to review them.
To give an Elon musk’s track record with his various companies. I think it is completely reasonable to question the ethics of this study.
It’s not the tech itself that worries me. It’s who in this case is supplying it along with the fact the previous patient had 85% of the functionality just stop and they haven’t done a damn thing to address that before they want to try it on another patient.
There are other companies working on the same or similar tech that are far less fucked up.
They did try to fix the problem the best they could. Its also a very intense procedure so I doubt it’s smart to go back after so little time. It’s probably better to wait until they fix all the kinks anyways. The man did enough, he doesn’t need to be a debug guinea pig with his head open every month imo.
I’d actually be mad if they used the same guy tbh.
I also think it’s important to seperate the tech from the persona. There’s a lot of smart people behind this and I think it’s sci-fi as fuck.
Look we all hate Elon and how neuralink is developing their tech that’s not in question here.
People are taking issue with your referring to desperate people with very very poor quality of life due to injuries or medical conditions as “brain dead”
They aren’t “brain dead”, dumb or stupid, they are reaching for what looks like the only potential light in their life. A life that is probably impossibly difficult for any of us typically healthy people to imagine.
You would have a life and people who care about you, regardless of use of your legs.
I’m pretty sure not everyone has a life and people who cares about them.
Then you are wrong.
Is that exclusive para/quadriplegics in your mind? Only that you are countering a statement that essentially says that losing one or more limbs doesnt make people stop loving you, by saying not everyone has people that love them. Which would be a good point if people not loving you was exclusive to people who have lost a limb or limbs…
Did you just try to angle my comment to be about people with disabilities being less capable and/or of less value?
What I countered was a claim where the first part stated that everyone has a life, which is just not true. For the second part of the claim to have any value in the sentence, the first part has to be true. Which it wasn’t.
Whether I read it wrong or not doesn’t change the fact that I never limited my statement to be about people with disabilities or disabilities automatically taking the life away from people.
So I stand by my claim, that not everyone of the 8 billion living in this planet has a life and people that care about them.
You were responding to a comment about quadriplegics which painted context to your response. If that’s not what you meant, then gine. Im sorry i misunderstood your response. You could have been more clear that you were generalising and not directly responding to the claim being made.
To your point. No not everyone has a life and people that love them but i would argue that a blanket statement that started this thread, that if you were a quadriplegic then you would volunteer to have experimental surgery with unknown side effects and effectiveness because you have nothing else going for you is not inherently true.
You dont need to be quadriplegic to want to volunteer. You dont have to not have anything else going for you, and you dont need to have a life or people that love you.
If all you are saying is not everyone has a life or people that live them, then i fail to see how its relevant to the point made in this thread.