• t3rmit3@beehaw.org
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        5 months ago

        Uh, what was? Running Hillary? I agree. Giving her control of the DNC before the primary? Also agree.

        • millie@beehaw.org
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          5 months ago

          Failing to run the incumbent was the bad strategic move. Also giving her control of the DNC, but Biden would have been an easy win at the time.

          Like, I would have loved to see Sanders, personally. Strategically, though? If you’re just thinking about getting a Democrat in the office? Biden was the play.

          Hit on 16 in blackjack, run your incumbent in elections. The odds do, in fact, matter. The actual odds, not the figures arrived at by making a few hundred thousand cold calls and finding the people who actually want to talk about politics, as if that weren’t a biasing factor in political position.

          • t3rmit3@beehaw.org
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            5 months ago

            Failing to run the incumbent was the bad strategic move

            It was the end of Obama’s 2nd term, and he couldn’t run again. There was no incumbent.

            If you’re just thinking about getting a Democrat in the office? Biden was the play.

            Biden would have had the same chance in 2016 as Hillary. The entire reason Obama beat Hillary out in the 2008 primary was that people didn’t want another white Centrist. The reason Biden won in 2020 was because of Trump, not because he was a good choice. He barely won.

            run your incumbent in elections. The odds do, in fact, matter.

            Didn’t work out for Trump, since he was so unpopular. Biden is also basically there, he’s just less hated than Trump. But this time, a lot of people are going to sit out if they’re not invigorated (as they were invigorated against Trump in 2020).

            The actual odds

            It’s very convenient to wave your hand and make nebulous claims about the “actual odds” without any evidence. Polling is no longer mostly done via cold calls, it’s mostly internet surveys, or via services that have paid-to-participate groups that are easy to control for, demographically.

    • Barry Zuckerkorn@beehaw.org
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      5 months ago

      It’s not just about pledged delegates

      The leadership of the DNC, DCCC, DSCC, etc., are chosen by election, by members of each committee. State parties send their delegates to participate in these things.

      despite not being an incumbent

      Yeah, that’s what I’m talking about. These are processes that longtime party members participate in, and run on, about the structural rules and procedures to follow, and they’re open to everyone. Elections often pit “establishment”/“insider” candidates against “insurgent”/“outsider” candidates, and there are examples of each kind (or hybrid candidates) winning the nomination in the modern primary system.

      It’s more of a spurious correlation: incumbency doesn’t buy the advantage in the nomination race, but reflects that a candidate has the network and resources to have the popular support of their own party. That’s why incumbents always win the nomination, and tend to win reelection in the general.