After playing World of Warcraft for 15 years, I started becoming increasingly bored and disgruntled with the game. The game being grindy and repetitive is no real surprise, I mean it’s an MMO. But the one thing that was really frustrating was paying monthly for a subscription and a huge chunk of cash for an expansion, but still having extra stuff flashed in my face all the time that was simply not possible to earn in-game. Mount skins, cosmetics, miscellaneous stuff that is only available in the Blizzard store. They also began adding loyalty items that require being subscribed every single month, and doing repetitive, extremely boring stuff on top of the other repetitive boring stuff, so basically double dipping on your grind, which really isn’t fun.
Aside from that, I also played other games that required a heavy amount of grinding too, and each one of them had similarly frustrating elements. Destiny 2, overwatch, Battlefield, Fortnite, Halo, and the list goes on. Each of them has the same issue: fear of missing out. FOMO basically makes it so that if you don’t seize the opportunity to spend real life money, you will never be able to obtain something really cool, because it’s only there for a short time, and then it’s gone, and you are made to feel guilty and bad about it. It’s just kind of depressing playing kind of games and realizing that you are now mentally dependent on financial transactions in order to get the full enjoyment of the game. That to me is a very very awful way to live life, and it really messes with your emotions
So I ditched every game that had any element of an in-game purchase. This is honestly helped my mental health a huge, huge amount. Now, I only play games that either have no microtransactions in them at all, or are completely free and 100% possible to play with no purchase required at all. So games like team fortress, deadlocked, Stardew Valley, and many other indie games that you can purchase and then never have to worry about getting suckered into the microtransaction cycle for
I cannot tell you how much better my mental health has been since I stopped playing Apex Legends, Overwatch, and Rocket League. I never had anything against the gameplay of these games but the microtransactions and battle passes were just straight up toxic. After a couple weeks you simply don’t give a shit anymore and it’s amazing. I see my roommate playing these games until 3 AM every day because he has to do his daily challenges for 4 different games. He’ll be so pissed off that he can barely speak as he powers through game after game to get them done so he can go to bed. And in hindsight, that’s probably what I used to look like back when I played those games.
Apex Legends … the microtransactions and battle passes were just straight up toxic
My friend bought Battlepass for Apex once because it had a pretty decent skin in it. Then, he was straight up *PISSED * when next season they had the most ridiculous, incredible looking skin ever. He felt like he had to purchase it again that season, and was bitter he spent money the previous season for something so mediocre. That kind of thought process is just awful. These games lure you right into it.
Apex battle passes have always given you enough credit to buy the next season’s pass. I’ve been playing since launch, I’ve completed all battle passes save for maybe 4, and I’ve spent a total of $10 on the game.
Until they start charging only money for the battle passes. I never even used 80% of the skins I got on the battle passes anyway. I just wanted them so I didn’t not have them. As someone that has over 2,000 hours in Apex, I’m so glad I jumped ship. The grass was very green on the other side.
Funny you should mention that. They attempted to do precisely this (only buy the BP with real money) a few months ago. The player base revolted, and they walked it back to the way things were.
He’ll be so pissed off that he can barely speak as he powers through game after game to get them done so he can go to bed.
If you want to help him get out of that, give him a burn or two every once in a while: “How are your second, third and fourth jobs coming along?” - “With all that work you do, you should ask for a raise!”
Hopefully he’ll realize he’s not playing, but working, and give up on that. Hopefully.
May I recommend taking it a step further and going for games that have no cycle in them at all? That is, finite games that you can play and actually finish, for good. That’s what I’ve been looking for a lot lately.
Some recommendations:
- The Talos Principle (puzzles with a story)
- Outer Wilds (best to go in blind, read absolutely nothing about it, not even the steam description)
- CrossCode (fast paced fun combat and a cool story and characters. Somewhat grindy but still finite)
- Beacon Pines (short and sweet visual novel)
- Chants of Sennaar (language translation game, surprisingly fun and satisfying)
Chants of Sennaar is absolutely one of my favorite games. It’s one of the few games I’ve played where the mechanics of the game and the themes of the game were in perfect harmony.
Not every game needs a story or campaign you can finish to be enjoyable. Playing random skirmishes in Age of Empires 2 or Supreme Commander can be loads of fun. Civilization 5 has scenarios that I suspect most players don’t even know exist (also, you can play Unciv for free). You can pick up and put down much like you’d do to boardgames.
Then there’s “infinite” games like Cities Skyline, RimWorld, Dwarf Fortress, Satisfactory. It’s ok to want once and done games, but games that you want to replay when they lack any mtx or dark patterns speaks something about your enjoyment
Definitely, not disagreeing with that. I’ve played plenty of those games too. I just find that “enjoyment per hour” is actually better with shorter, finite games. But I also find myself spending a lot of time playing Civ or Stellaris haha
What’s the SorteKanin description of Outer Wilds?
Well… Without spoiling anything I would say, you are a member of an alien species on another planet. You are also an aspiring astronaut about to take your first journey into space. Let’s just say your journey is quite remarkable.
I’m not them but…
Outer Wilds is a gem of a 3D first-person indie game. Other games might have you find required items so you can progress (like Pokemon or Zelda games), but in this game it’s all about the knowledge you learn while playing (like Tunic). You explore, learn, and puzzle solve. By looking up anything about the game, or by looking up a solution to a puzzle, you essentially lock yourself out of experiencing that piece of content. It’s all about the journey.
It’s a game you can only really play once, but it is so worth it. It’s my favorite video game and I wish I could forget everything about it so I can play it again for the first time.
If everyone was following your path, micro transactions wouldn’t be there anymore.
I was thinking of Stardew Valley and Rimworld while reading your post, sure enough SDW was mentioned at the end :D
The Java edition of Minecraft is also pretty good for having no microtransactions.
And modpacks…all the modpacks! All of them turn the game into a whole new game.
Sell me on rimworld! What do you like about it/what do ya like to do
Rimworld is a great Colony Sim if you love the idea of Dwarf Fortress but want a gameplay experience that’s much more accessible with a much softer learning curve.
It plays into the chaotic post apocalyptic Mad Max style hellscape fantasy really well, and does not attempt to police your morality. You can love and care for your colonists, meeting their needs and growing to know them as individual people with their own unique stories, or you can play as efficiently or sadistically as you like, throwing ethics out the window and following the Geneva Suggestions wherever you deem prudent.
The base game is good for hundreds of hours of play, and expansions bump that up to thousands of hours of fun, but it also has a very healthy modding community if that’s still not enough.
If you’re unfamiliar with the Colony Sim genre, the basic idea is that you start with a set of semi-randomized colonists on a randomized map and need to build up a functioning Colony to survive. You the player take the role of a manager or overlord and set tasks for your colonists to complete, which they then take time to carry out while you watch and plan the next set of tasks. You need to gather materials, build shelter, grow or hunt food, defend yourself from wildlife and raiders, and recruit new colonists.
Rimworld in particular has fun building mechanics with an emphasis on building power grids and heat management (air conditioning and heating to keep your colonists comfy and keep food from spoiling). It’s a lot like a top-down Oxygen Not Included, but with simpler mechanics and more focus on its (procedurally generated) story.
Neat! Thank you for taking the time to make such a comprehensive review. Sounds like it’s up my alley! I enjoyed Frostpunk and the Tropico series (as well as Banished although I thought it was sort of boring after a while).
Ooh. I’ve heard of Frostpunk and Tropico but never played them myself. If they’re similar to Rimworld I need to check them out.
They’re similar in that they’re colony builders :)
Cannibalism is a viable option. Do you need more?
Child labour was what got me into Frostpunk. Sold.
I knew a guy who got real into it and started an “Accidental Cannibal Cult”. It was fun to listen to, if nothing else - I don’t get into those games much. Kinda like hearing EVE Online or Dwarf Fortress stories.
Over 2000 hour of play and i never won once but had so much fun losing in some really stupid way and some tragic one too.
With the mod and dlc each new game are mostly unique
The colonists you are given all have character traits and there is a social aspect of the game. Colonists can start relationships, start families, break up, start social fights and end up in infirmarry… Sometimes, family members of your colonists come to your colony as raiders. All these stories forming during gameplay is the real strength of the game for me.
For example, there was this one colonist woman in one of my playthroughs. She was the tough, soldier type. She started one or two relationships in the colony but ended them. Then she tried to go back to them. It started creating some complicated feelings among the colony so I sent her to scavenge a nearby abandoned base.
Before she can leave, a band of raiders popped in. One of the raiders was her teenage son! So I start getting so invested in saving the son and bringing him back to the colony. I’m not that skilled in combat or tactics so I save the game multiple times until a trap injures the boy so his mom can snatch him without fighting. She takes him into one of the intact rooms in the ruin and patches up his wound, shares her food. (She takes him prisoner and you can keep talking to prisoners and convert them into your colonists. )
Here is a scene where raiders running around outside, raiding. And a mother and son, hunkered down in a room, trying to reconnect.
While the boy is recovering in the impromptu prison room, she gets out and shoots the raiders one by one. Rest of the raiders leave the map after losing enough members.
Mother and son talk about family, son talks about some childhood memories. Eventually, he is no longer a prisoner but a newly recruited member of the colony. Woman comes back with her son. Son turns out to be a psychopath but that’s ok. At the Rim, we love psychopaths, they do gruesome task of disposing raider corpses, for example, without getting emotional strain.
Mother stopped creating drama in the colony after son joined.
…
If you read people’s stories in the steam comments (there are a lot of war crime simulator stories, too, be warned) you may get why it’s so addictive.
Wild.
i don’t know when or how it happened but once i realised FOMO was being used against players regularly and aggressively i just- stopped caring. Oh a limited time special one week offer especially for me now and never again? Too bad i just launched the game and have no intention of buying your “newbie pack”. Oh my event limited time items? Dang, those look expensive, anyway i’m happy with my normal looking armour and normal looking tools/guns cheers
& i only ever buy cheap cosmetics. If your game is bad and grindy when i play it without throwing money at the screen then your game is bad and grindy & i will tell all my friends about that experience
Yeah, that’s the attitude I take with this shit now.
I play a stupid colour matching game on my iPad that’s almost scientifically designed to try and rinse money out of users’ pockets, but I’ve got to a place where I see the offers and last chances and know that even if I did pay for a few boosts or power ups, it’s not going to bring me enlightenment.
That’s not to shit on OP’s point, mind. Microtransactions really are a menace, preying on those who are least able to ignore them, who are often least able to afford them. But it’s a world we’ve kinda made by not wanting to pay for games.
That said, how much is WoW these days? Paying a monthly fee AND getting bombarded with ways to spend more money is straight-up cunty.
This is pretty much me. I don’t play games just to unlock stuff so if the game isn’t fun for me then I’ll just walk away and find something else
My mental health improved after dropping games with time gating and or daily quests
I was just talking about farmville the other day, howbmassive it was. Feel like it was an early example of this
My 80-year-old mother is stil hooked on Hay Day (2012 Farmville clone). She doesn’t alarm-clock overnight events any more, but that could be because she can’t sleep through the night now. Got a team of other old ladies around the world for contests, and it’s right on the edge of where I think it’s great that she’s got something to keep her engaged versus might need an addiction intervention.
I’m not usually one for those types of games but I had a lot of fun with the player economy of Hayday. You don’t even need to do any farming, there were always desperate players selling low and buying high lol
WoW auction house feelings right there. Dunno how it is nowadays, but I remember that back on Battle for Azeroth, that was the only way to get the 5 million gold for a super exclusive mount
I started playing only arcade games for some months now and I’m so happy, this games are just gameplay and nothing more!
I’m glad I’ve had a few epiphanies over my gaming time that have resulted in no desire to spend any money on P2W or content skipping.
First one was in the first Turok game on N64. I was playing normally but at some point looked up the cheat codes for things like unlock all weapons, unlimited ammo, and unlocking all levels. There was one weapon that you needed to collect hidden pieces of from each level, and then you only got 3 shots with it that would pretty much AoE clear an area. There was another gun that you’d only find 2 shots of ammo for at a time that was similar. I had fun for a bit running around and shooting those guns at will, but after that it was hard to get motivated to play the game without the cheats because I knew the big weapons were basically just temporary consumables, which meant I’d probably never use them while trying to ration them for moments they’d be most useful. Using those cheat codes ruined the game for me.
The second epiphany was after raiding for a while in WoW and thinking about the loot motivation. It was a circular motivation: you get better loot so that you can raid more to get even better loot. If the loot was the main motivation, then it was pointless because the loot didn’t serve any purpose outside of the game. So it only made sense to do raiding because I enjoyed the process, not because of the rewards. And this applied to most reward mechanisms in games. Taking that logic just a bit further made me realize that P2W is actually paying money to avoid playing a game and short circuit right to getting the rewards, which was kinda pointless when the rewards were meant to improve the experience of playing the game. Either a) you don’t want to play the game at all, or b) you don’t get as much satisfaction from using the better loot or whatever because you skipped the part where you had to do it without those rewards.
And then the last one is finding PvP less satisfying when the game mechanics give significant advantages based on either time spent grinding or paying money to avoid grinding. Did I just win because of my skills or because I’ve acquired better gear? Did I just lose because the other player outplayed me or because they got better gear? And I didn’t even want to give any satisfaction to those who just paid money to win and don’t worry about what it does or doesn’t say about their skills. It’s similar to the line of thought when you know cheating is possible… Did I get beat by someone skilled enough to aim better or someone using an aim bot?
Comparing P2W to cheating is spot on, especially as these are much more heavily advertised and used in PvP games. What really annoys me is when these players, or similars that never go after equivalent players, feel all superior despite showing zero skill
On WoW, I remember playing a few times on instant 255 private servers, back in 2007-2010. It felt so damn pointless to me, especially as the raids still needed you to make a raid group. I enjoyed a portion of the grind, even as a mostly solo player.
This should be the new gaming copy pasta. I applaud your rational introspection, and solid writing.
It’s refreshing seeing your list since people often blame gachas nowadays, but MMOs were the issue originally, it’s just that other genres took a lesson from MMOs so now we have way more grinding options and it gets tiresome.
I really appreciate that because someone was over here trying to convince me to play a gacha game claiming that it’s not that bad. Some people just don’t get it
I don’t think its so much the microtransactions as it is games with a highly competitive spirit. PvP games in particular. I don’t find myself having any negative feelings after playing a game like Zenless Zone Zero or Goddess of Victory NIKKE, but after about two matches of Dead by Daylight, a game with a notoriously toxic playerbase, I definitely feel worse than before I play, particularly if the matches do not go well for me.
Im the kind of player that doesn’t spend money unless I feel like something provides me value. Ive played ZZZ since release and haven’t spent a single cent, and NIKKE since its release and only spent $25 total. I have enough self-control to handle those games and can spot bad value in games like gacha games pretty fast. So for me it isn’t really about microtransactions, its definitely about competition with other players, and interactions with them. Playing a game of DBD, winning, and then having everyone (usually TTV streamers) call you names in chat or on their stream and report/mercilessly harrass you ( for winning in a video game, mind you) is a completly different level of toxic that I doubt many would be able to properly handle long term.
Its why I pretty much never recommend DBD to people.
I don’t find myself having any negative feelings after playing a game like Zenless Zone Zero
I agree with the rest of what you said but this part is crazy. Gacha games are so heavily monetized it’s wild. I played zenless as well up until a few weeks ago, that game is such a trash can. I used every single currency that I had earned in the entire game and couldn’t get The character I wanted. Some people spend as much as $2,000 on the game just trying to get a single character. That kind of gambling is even worse than what I’m talking about
Well the issue is that some people confuse a want for a need.
Wanting characters is great but the problem comes from being disappointed that you didn’t get what you want as fast as you thought you should. The true method of playing a gacha game is like running a marathon, its not a race and you take it slow. Play in your free time, down time, whatever. I don’t play those games as my main game, just as a side game. Sometimes I miss a day for the login or a special event or even a character that I really wanted but at the end of the day, its just a video game and I am not going to die without that thing or character I wanted. If I get it, its simply a bonus to the joy I get from playing the game already. I don’t play a game long if I don’t have fun with it at least more than when I don’t.
Some people don’t have self control, and I am not saying that the games are not monetized in a predatory way. But I view it no different from actual gachapon: capsule toys. You know, like a gumball machine, but the little plastic ball that has a random small toy or stickers inside. You pay, turn the knob, and you always win something, you just don’t know what. To me, I dont consider that the same as gambling like with a slot machine. That’s just my opinion, and I sure I am in the minority with that, and with my overall attitude towards gacha games in general.
Any lottery style game (let’s be honest, Gacha = Lottery) is psychologically harmful in my opinion because it trains you to gamble, there’s no other way around it. These games purposefully condition you to spend currency that you’ve earned, lose majorly, and then get rushes of dopamine when you finally win. They are designed to keep you wanting more. If you think I’m making this up, then read Got ya!: The Psychology of Gacha Addiction
Gacha games have mastered the art of making us eagerly anticipate each draw, activating our brain’s reward system and flooding us with dopamine — the pleasure neurotransmitter. It’s the chemical cocktail that keeps us engaged, excited, and coming back for more. Next on the list is the ‘just one more try’ mentality
There’s nothing remotely healthy about this at all, which runs completely contrary to what my personal goals are
Well as I said, it is my opinion and I have the self-control to be able to play and enjoy gacha games without being financially irresponsible. When I pull for a character in a gacha game, for example, I just skip the animation to go directly to the results. Not only is it faster but it also bypasses the “anticipation building” that the animation and sound effects create. I am glad you have learned for yourself how to have better mental health, but I am saying for me its not about MTX, its more about competition or competitive style games.
Don’t get me wrong, I still play competitive games. I love me some Battlefield 4, Forza Motorsport, Dead By Daylight (when the people I play against decide to not be serial harrassers), and others. Its just that I try to view it differently. Again, its only a video game and at the end of the day, I am not going to die over anything in the game, winning or losing or whatever. It can sometimes make me feel bad when I have a long losing streak or if I get harrassed, but when that happens I just turn off that game for a week or two and play something else. I don’t have to go to the extreme of uninstalling, but I can understand that some do and that’s totally fine.
Just ditch the idea that you need any of those things. You don’t. From a personal gaming perspective, these have been great for me because I get to play all of these games for free because other people are paying for it for me.
I understand the joy comes from playing the game itself, not the loot.
This is a life lesson as well. You don’t need any of the flashy shit. Trying to avoid it is a losing battle, better to just understand it.
I play a lot of deadlock right now and i think it’s fantastic. But even if it’s like in early alpha, i already miss the base designs, because i assume it’s gonna turn into a tf2/call of duty nightmare, once the looboxes are in.
yeah I never understood the point and unlocking loot boxes that are just having some skin in them. I’ve never once done it. i bought a skin once for fortnite cuz it’s a free game and okay I guess. that was my $1 donation to the publishers
Whenever I feel FOMO, I just remind myself of all the other FOMO items I bought in past games and how much I don’t care about them anymore.
When I did this quitting thing from MMOs and FOMO inducing gachas that you describe, I suddenly
- got a non-dead-end job
- got a girlfriend
- got a promotion
- travelled around Europe
- girlfriend died
- travelled around Europe some more
- got another girlfriend
- ended up in Canada
- got married
- got kids
- stuck in dead-end job again without promotion for the past five years
I still think it was worth it to quit though. My mind just gets stimuli from the seemingly simplest things, like looking at a beautiful tree on the roadside, brutalist architecture, interesting conversations that I focus on instead of my mind wandering onto the next mount or raid boss I will have to tackle.
And when it comes to gaming, if I want to satisfy my itch for twitch and a bit of adrenaline, roguelites scratch it the best, without the long term commitment to playing them for days or even hours.
But what works best to keep sanity is exercise, and with riding a road bike at least twice a day I can combine elevated heart rate with zoning out and Zen for stress relief really well. It’s simply meditative.
I think of the twelve years I’ve spent playing MMOs fondly, lots of memories were made. But I would never do it again. And it has nothing to do with self-control, and willpower to not start it again, although quitting cold turkey definitely required both. But it had everything to do with the realization that it’s a trap that’s a poor substitute for real life, even if real life has dealt you shitty cards.
I can spot the hazy, reality-disconnected look of addicts from a mile away. The self-deluding statements when the topic somehow gets brought up. And I can do nothing but feel a bit sad for them, and hope that somewhere, someone manages to gently nudge them on a path that helps them escape from this trap.
Wtf, is this some (copy) pasta?
If it isn’t it should be our Lemmy pasta with sauce IMO!
If you want to scratch a similar itch, and have not already, try Guild Wars 2.
It does have microtransactions, but only because they have no subscription fee and they are mostly cosmetic with a few rare exceptions.
It also has no FOMO except cosmetics from certain festivals, which you can also buy in the next year.
It is still the best MMO on the market IMHO, because it values your time and money compared to other games in the genre.
You know I’m a true RS fan when I say stuff like “Jagex is a shit company run by morons.”
Welcome to capitalism. Big gaming companies do not care about games anymore, they care about how to maximise profits. Their games are manipulative and developed together with psychologists solely to get your hard earned money at any opportunity. They got so good at it, that they are able to release pieces of software which are looking like games but actually are milking machines and no games at all.
You just have to take a step back and you will be able to easily differentiate between products of corporate greed and games.
Games once were supposed to be entertaining and even art. And there are still some, mostly indies.
We’ll take cash, we’ll take checks,
We’ll take credit cards, we’ll take jewelry,
We’ll take your momma’s dentures if they got gold in them!
