Apple being Apple again. Just why does anyone actually like that company?
Man, they’re seething against the EU, totally pissed that the legislators worked against their abuse over developers and rubbed against their cash cow.
Apple is all about money and fucking the user, being no different from Meta or Google. All they have is shinier hardware.
Much worse than Google IMO, at least when it comes to fucking with rules made by EU. Google usually tries to appeal legally and if it doesn’t work out, they do what they must. This Apple bulshittery with 3rd party app stores is a new one. Someone here in this thread said that the worst EU can do to companies breaking DMA is forcing them to sell the division. I would love for Apple to push EU that far.
Companies working against technical standards are basically working against society. And no one fights standards quite like Apple.
But but but muh innovation! Standards ruin that! /s
I’d argue they have better hardware. I’d love to have an iPhone running stock Android.
I mean the og comment literally said “all they have is shinier hardware”
Just read it wrong since Google was mentioned right before the start of the final sentence
Costs a fortune, hard to repair, no SD slot, no headphone jack, until recently could not be used with the chargers you have for everything else… At least for me it is a “no”.
That would be the dream :)
Apple is scary because they succeeded at creating a sect by frontal assault, so to say.
Google did that very subtly and precisely in the 00s, and like a decade ago firmly diverted to the MS way.
MS didn’t go in the cult direction, they slowly and steadily capitalized on their monopolistic power with moderation and modesty.
While Apple almost from the beginning just shat on everybody and everybody asked for more. They even took the counterculture niche partially in the 90s and 00s. And for clueless people it’s still them.
Fuck apple with a cactus.
Sideways.
Lol, what phone are you using?
Edit: Why am I being downvoted? The dude said to fuck someone with a cactus. That’s hilarious - no one else thinks that’s funny? I’m still laughing lol
OnePlus 10 pro.
Would never sacrifice the flexibility and customizability of an Android device for the clunky and unintuitive UI of an iPhone.
You can say many things about apple but clunky and unintuitive would not be it.
You only find Apple’s UI intuitive because you’re used to it.
I don’t find it intuitive at all. Whenever I’ve used an iPhone, I’ve had to ask for help.
And I’m a full stack web developer, who contributes to some other software projects in my spare time. I’ve been around computers a fair bit.
Operating systems these days are complicated. It’s difficult to make them immediately intuitive to a new user. This isn’t a dig at Apple. Any modern, highly featured OS is like this.
Same. I have no idea how to use an iphone. Even basic things are frustrating.
Just wanted to chime in that I’m not an apple user, I primarily use android and windows. iPad is the only iOS device I use. I flat out disagree with clunky, Apple’s UI design (on iOS at least) is beautiful. UX wise, I can’t comment on functional differences between Android and iOS, at this stage in time, both are comparably usable for most people.
Some apple user experience choices definitely feel clunky.
Plugging an iPhone into a computer to move files around is a nightmare. The way notifications work on iOS is extremely clunky. Pairing non-apple devices to your apple device is purposely made clunky. Bastardising PWAs has led to them being clunky af.
Using MacOS and having to memorise some wild keyboard shortcuts is clunky. Not being able to minimise a program by clicking the icon in the dock feels clunky. MacOS flipping out when you want to tile one window but not another feels clunky. Apple’s workspace view and app menu view not being integrated together (a la Gnome Activities view) feels clunky. The whole app installation process (outside of the Mac store) is super clunky.
Apple is extremely visually consistent. But they absolutely have UX clunkiness, just as the others do. It’s fine though, most people don’t care. I’m pretty anal about these things.
I mean this is all subjective of course, but something like installing apps on macOS is extremely easy. Like Windows, apps can install themselves in about three or so different ways (not including managed devices), but most macOS apps you download are simply dragged into the applications folder - that’s it. To uninstall, you drag the app to the trash bin and empty the trash.
I compel you to try to snap to tile a single windows to a side of the desktop in a macOS fresh install.
spoiler
You can’t because, to do that thing that every single desktop environment can do out of the box, you need to install a third party app on macOS. This and many other QoL features that are bog standard on Windows and Linux today are not present on macOS.
Now, I want you to tell me out of the top of your head, what does pressing the green button achieves on the window for Safari? Do you think it will do the same on the settings window? What will it do for the App Store? Do you think it will do the same thing on all three or three different things? Which one do you expect?
Final challenge, make the window for the calculator stay on top of all other windows.
So why fuck Apple? You’re using an Android device, Apple has updated their software in a way that doesn’t compel you to want to try an Apple device, end of story why all the vitriol?
I could see, maybe, if you were already an Apple user and wanted them to make a change that you want on your device. But having so much hate for a device you have no intention of using anyway?
This change impacts every mobile user, not just iPhone users. iPhones are a good portion of the userbase of most apps/websites. For PWAs to gain mass adoption, it needs to be available for the majority of users. This change means that will not be the case in the EU.
PWAs have just been doomed by Apple, and unless Apple reverts this change, they will now never be successful in the EU. And probably not even outside of the EU since non-european products still have european users.
I don’t think that’s why this guy is mad
Motorola
My man!
I got it and it made me laugh
Just why does anyone actually like that company?
I mean, if Google weren’t shit, I’m sure Android would be more viable. They’ve can’t even keep a consistent brand! They’ve gone from Google Play this and that, to migrating everything - including podcasts - to YouTube.
migrating everything - including podcasts - to YouTube
If only there were other apps for podcasts on Android, it would be a viable operating system.
Google is kind of crap, but Android has a lot more built-in escape hatches than iOS does. People don’t seem to use them as much as I’d hoped, but they’re available.
I’ve been using Podcast Addict for years now. Dunno why people think they are bound to one thing when Android offers so many choices.
I think they’re just have choice paralysis. There’s too much stuff on Android, and picking something is really rather anoying.
Something like a Gallery. There’s probably a 1000 galleries on Play Store, 50% of them are “my first app”, that display a fullscreen ad every other photo.
You have to know what you want, research it, then get it. Non-nerds don’t really care about that.
My guess. I’m a nerd who does care about all that.
You do have a point, but each App’s play store page itself shows whether it has ads or in-app purchases. One can use that as an indicator for selecting an app. So people just need to pay attention to the small text right below the App’s title
Then there is always f-droid . You can find really good quality software without ads in fdroid. I rarely use the play store these days (except when I have to update whatsapp and banking apps)
Again, you’re telling this to an android nerd. I’m aware.
I’m speaking from a perspective of an average joe, who is 100% not aware of the existance of F-droid or is convinced that it’s malware.
I’m also don’t expect people sift through hundreds of apps, opening each page and checking permissions/ads/reviews.
People install apps either because they’ve heard about it on TV/whatever, or a friend told them to install this specific app.
This is why people rely on default apps, and compare “phones” based on that.
I will confess I used Google podcasts for years not realizing that the FOSS alternatives were MASSIVE improvements.
Is there a podcast app that automatically plays the next episode of podcasts in the correct order (oldest to newest)?
I’ve tried a bunch of podcast apps and none of them seem to do that like Google podcasts did, unless I’m using them wrong.
Antennapod can do that. You can define the sort order per show.
Pocketcasts fixed that a while ago. You can set the sorting of episodes for each podcast and then it plays in that order.
That’s google’s strategy though.
Although they let you have full control and don’t force you to use their apps, it’s setup so the majority just use the defaults and are discouraged to sway away from google’s ways.
Its fully intentional.
While I totally agree, the average Joe is just going to gravitate to whomever controls the ecosystem. Kinda hard to trust a higher authority when they can’t even get their in-house shit together.
Are you implying that the average user doesn’t know how to install an app? My 80 yo parents do that on their samsung tablet.
No need to trust any higher authorities, whatever that means
I think they mean the average person isn’t going to take the time to check 20 different contacts apps in the store to find the perfect one, then do it again with every other basic app on their phone.
They’re just gonna use the default app 99%
I’m implying that people choose the path of least resistance.
Gotcha, sorry misunderstood
Android is more popular globally, the only place where it isn’t true (AFAIK) is USA where the colour of the text bubble is important for reasons that defy logic.
where the colour of the text bubble is important for reasons that defy logic.
That’s just a thing tweens and teens do, it’s just like when kids were obsessed with expensive shoes when I was a kid and would ostracize the kids who couldn’t afford them. No sane adult I have ever met gave a shit about my text bubbles.
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If that company is serious about conducting professional business for any length of time, they’ll learn better soon enough. In my industry, we still use dialup modems to remotely manage some equipment. You’d be fired for telling a customer to fuck off for not having a specific phone.
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That’s half-true. No adults I voluntarily associate with care what brand of phone anybody else has in theory, but a lot of the iPhone owners are vehemently unwilling to install any third-party messaging apps. That means:
- Messaging about anything where security is important is a problem. Most people don’t have big secrets, but sending things that could be used for identity theft isn’t terribly rare.
- Exchanging high-quality media is impossible.
- People will exclude non-iPhone users from group chats because falling back to MMS is a bad experience for everyone.
Yeah. We usually mock apple users in my country xd they go in high debt to get one of those candy bricks and can’t even afford a cellular plan afterwards. Lmao
Google’s marketing department defies logic every day.
Is that your biggest concern about a tech company? Id be happy for marketing departments to he shut down and the money redirected to make better/cheaper products.
While Google sucks now and has for a while, in their early days they have demonstrated that marketing is not all it takes to make innovative, successful products.
On the opposite end of the spectrum, Apple obsession with marketing has created fanboys that spend the night queuing up to be the first to get the latest iPhone, and that don’t question the technology or ethics (or anything) behind the flashing toy that they crave. Good for the executives and the shareholder but as a customer?
Fuck google buy a google pixel then put grapheneos on it
Fuck Google
Give them money
Is there another option?
Other options are Fairphone, Volla, Murena - or flashing “vanilla” custom ROM’s on phones other than Pixels - or using Ubuntu Touch, Plasma Mobile, Mobian, Droidian or Sailfish OS.
Its kinda ironic that google pixel is the only phone with decent secirity hardware and an unlockablw bootloader.
Buy a second-hand Google Pixel.
They would make a lot more money on that purchase if it’s vanilla android though. Yes, you’re spending money on the hardware, but is Google really known for making bank on just hardware sales?
- Buy an old Xperia 10 III.
- Flash SailfishOS there
- ???
- Profit
buy a used phone
I moved from android to iphone 2 years ago. As soon as this piece of crap dies, I’m moving back to android.
Heh, welcome back soon!
looking forward to being able to have separate volumes for notifications and ringer again… "#/(%)&#)$%&
For me the notifications were the biggest gripe.
Unfortunately that’s not a stock Android thing, so weird
Really? Pixels have had that function for a while now. I always assumed it was stock.
I have a Pixel, notification and ringer are combined
I am not a huge fan of Apple but they will probably be stuck on iOS for a while. Their phones last quite a long time and get updates for very long.
honestly, the shitty user experience might make me chuck it into the trash before it actually dies.
Haha, that’s fair enough.
i find it absolutely hilarious when iphone fans talk about a polished user experience, it’s a joke.
no one complains about their phones more than iphone users
As does every good phone in that price range.
Updates though?
This year’s top Samsung has 7 years of updates guaranteed.
How was it earlier?
5 years, before that 3 years, before that worse and not even standardized.
welcome back, let’s hope Play Integrity has an exploit found in case you bought a Xiaomi or Alcatel or whatever.
Aah, the security again…
Fuck this company
Welp, this might be kbin for me. It’s the only circumstance I’ve really found a PWA necessary, although I’ve considered making PWAs of some online shops I frequent.
I suspect Apple is eliminating PWAs from safari in the EU just because they don’t want to be forced to allow 3rd party browsers to do the same. Let’s go ahead and throw the baby out with the bathwater.
I’ve actually got a U.S. apple account on an iPhone bought in Japan, and living in the EU temporarily. It’ll be interesting to see how this is going to play out for me.
Apple really sucks hard! What a terrible company! 🤮🤮
Whoever buys apple shit will learn eventually. Or just go extinct.
Some services, like Facebook Gaming, use web apps as a way to get around the Apple App Store and its fees.
Smell coming out from this little hole here :)
Well, now they can use their own Facebook App Store on iPhones in EU, so not sure it really changes anything for them.
Their own Facebook App Store would have to pay the same fees to Apple as the Apple App Store under Apple’s generous terms. Losing the web app escape hatch is a 30% revenue loss
Yeah, I’ll wait until EU has their say, because the shit Apple came up with goes against what EU is trying to achieve.
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Why should I pay apple because my user decided to buy a shitty phone
As a sysadmin and self-hoster this decision will absolutely make me drop Apple 150%. A clean and well implemented pwa was a big reason I have stuck with my iPhone 12 despite buying a pixel 7. I know there are options on Android but they all have issues either in ux or in ui that makes it very obvious I’m using a pwa.
Another reason to keep hating apple. Fascists corporate america
This is a Reddit-style circle jerk. A LOT of people like Apple, because even though they’re almost as remorseless as Amazon or Microsoft or Google when it comes to maximizing profits, they build good products, create new product categories, and they’ve been doing both of those things for 40 years.
Is this a sleazy thing to do? Yup. Is it as sleazy as Meta intentionally allowing its algorithm to push softcore kiddie porn to teen Instagram users? Nope. Not even in the same ballpark.
Ah, sounds like what-about-ism. Metas behavior doesn’t exempt Apple from criticism. That logic tends to drive all of our standards and expectations down.
Theres room to criticize and expect more from all of these companies who are more than capable of doing better.
That’s fair. It is whataboutism (is that one word or 7?) And, I’m pissed off not only that Apple is messing with basic DMA compliance, but that they literally forked all their software rather than do this in the US.
At the same time, I hate Apple the least of big tech, since they actually do give a crap about building good products and have done quite a bit of that. One can make the argument that zero other big tech companies do.
Should we expect more of all of them? I’m not gonna die on that hill! It is way, way too late to stop this corporatocracy, but one can hope.
Apple builds marketing, not good products. There was a time they were innovative, and it is not now. Their price/performance ratio is laughable.
I have to disagree when it comes to laptops: the gap has closed a bit now, but there’s still no intel- or amd-based alternative that comes close to the MacBook air in terms of performance/battery life at the £1000-£1200 price point. When the M1s first came out, the fanless MacBook air shattered the intel i9 MBP in any conceivable metric other than pure GPU power (which the MacBook Pro could use for about a minute before overheating).
Even if expensive, the current MacBook lineup is really compelling. If you’re prepared to spend £3000 on a laptop, you just can’t get anything similar in terms of performance, battery life, and noise. You might get a workstation like an HP ZBook with similar oomph but then you’re looking at a beast that weighs 50% more than a comparable MBP, has the fans buzzing all the time at full blast, and lasts a couple hours on a battery charge. I’ve used my work MacBook Pro (M1 Max) for a full Atlantic flight of ≈9 hours and it still had juice to go.
They start at £1,150
MacBooks in that price range fall apart frequently due to only having 8GB of RAM. They’re e-waste.
You’ve got to spend ~£500 more to get one with alright specs. And even for that £1,650 price point you only get 512GB storage (are you fucking serious, Apple? A £500 Acer has that amount!)
And please don’t regurgitate Apple’s “our RAM is magic RAM so you don’t need much of it” nonsense.
I have no idea what you’re on about. MacBook airs start at £999, and I’ve still been able to configure one at £1199 with 16 GB of RAM.
Also I haven’t said anything about that magic ram nonsense, please don’t try to paint me as an idiot. Even my personal laptop has 32 GB. But different needs, different price points. I still maintain that at the price points apple operates, it’s hard to find something better with windows - not because I’m an apple fanboy by any means, but because of the laziness of Intel and the lack of decent ARM alternatives (and Microsoft’s half assed approach to ARM).
I was talking about the current generation, not a 3 year old model. Similarly if I was talking about iPhone pricing, I’d bring up the iPhone 15, not 12.
You need to add ram to at least 16GB, and storage to at least 512GB, otherwise not only do you have a pathetic amount of storage, but your storage speeds are crippled (which apple unfortunately tries of obfuscate).
That takes the price up to £1,650. £500 more than the base price.
And I didn’t say you said anything about magic RAM. I said please don’t regurgitate it in response. I see it a lot. 8GB of RAM is straight up e-waste.
I can’t believe Apple wasn’t sued over their “our RAM is… like… magic, bruh” statements
At the same time, I hate Apple the least of big tech, since they actually do give a crap about building good products and have done quite a bit of that.
That’s an incredibly low bar. There are exceptions of course but I’d argue there really is no need to use “big tech” software much of the time. Smartphones are probably the most challenging, but desktops and laptops? Easy to avoid.
is that one word or 7?
It’s a word, with a formal dictionary definition: “the technique or practice of responding to an accusation or difficult question by making a counter-accusation or raising a different issue”.
It has it’s origins in politics.
since they actually do give a crap about building good products and have done quite a bit of that
That hasn’t been true for quite a few years.
create new product categories
[chasing goose meme]
Like what?
LIKE WHAT MOTHERFUCKER!?
Rounded corners I guess.
they build good products
Which they charge x4 the value, and always underdeveloped one or two key features in order to scalp further inordinate amounts of money from their users to overcome the underperforming feature they neutered intentionally. Anyone buying from Apple is a chump getting taken advantage of and somehow is convinced to be proud of being abused by a corp.
They do sell good products… Kinda. But they are professional scalpers and scammers. iPhones get their performance nerfed via software after a few years to force you to upgrade. They charge Quadruple price for ram upgrades in their laptops. Now they’re removing, not dropping support, but actively removing a feature that they themselves do not have to develop to stop you installing a feature on a device that you pay for.
Apple do not make superior products, apart from the iPad that’s a genuinely superior product. They sell a walled garden that you have to pay continuous subscriptions to stay in. The subscription in this sense is their app store.
Besides iPod and iPhone. What product category did Apple create that wasn’t there already?
Imo Apple rolls good solutions, but they very rarely actually innovate.
Is this a sleazy thing to do? Yup
That makes it illegal. The DMA explicitly requires gatekeepers be “proactive” (that’s their words) towards opening up their platform. Removing features just in the EU is the opposite of that.
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Whataboutism much?
Queue the Apple dick riders defending their precious megacorp from being a POS company
*Cue
Nah, they are lining up to defend their favorite company.
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Queue?
Qwayway?
The probably couldn’t afford the development /s
But on the positive side, Apple is now forced to allow other app stores on all phones in the EU.
So that’s probably a bigger win than this is a loss.
Depends on whether your app is distributed as a PWA or not. Mine is, so it kinda touches me personally.
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You can, but then I’d have to pay $99 per year to Apple to have it on the App Store. 3rd party app stores are gonna be a wild west for a while, so not sure it’s viable as an option.
I just made my app as a PWA, just few months ago, just to support iOS. F**k them. I’m not making any effort for iOS apps anymore.
Yep, fuck them. For me it was not the deciding factor in making my app a PWA, but it definitely was one of the reasons I went for it.
I already had android app written in kotlin, so I didn’t need PWA. I guess it’s cool that I can use this PWA on computer, even if nobody would use my app on computer. When somebody asks me, why my app is not on App Store, I just ask them, would they pay 99$ per year for an app, and they say never. Well, there is your answer.
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Apple being Apple again. Just why does anyone actually like that company?
Marketing and build quality goes a long way to making people feel like a company is good.
What’s this fabled build quality that other phones in the same price range don’t have?
Sure others have the same build quality, but not the decades of marketing that Apple has. You gotta have both to get people to be irrationally loyal to a company.
